Altra Vanish Carbon 2 Review
By Matthew Klein, Andrea Myers, and David Salas
Altra Vanish Carbon 2Price: $259.95 at Running Warehouse
Weight: 8.1 oz, 229 g (men's size 9), 5.8 oz, 164 g (women's size 8)
Stack Height: 36 mm / 36 mm
Drop: 0 mm
Shoe Purpose: Super Racing Shoe
Pros: The Only Anatomic Zero Drop Super Shoe, Fast, Slightly Flexible Carbon Plate, New Foam Blend Bouncy/Fast
Cons: Still Lower Than Average Outsole Durability, Flex Grooves Might Be Positioned Too Far Posteriorly for Some
RUNNING SHOE SUMMARY
The Altra Vanish Carbon 2 is the first true anatomic, zero-drop super racing shoe on the market. An upgraded EGO PRO midsole provides a true super foam bounce while a strategically designed plate provides torsional stiffness and some mild snappy flexibility in the forefoot. A taller stack height further brings this shoe into the super shoe realm while a redesigned upper helps maintain a lower weight and super comfortable, anatomic fit. While the durability is still a bit of an issue, the Vanish Carbon 2 finally brings Altra in the super shoe game for those who want high performance without sacrificing natural fit and foot position.
SIMILAR SHOES: None
PAST MODEL: Altra Vanish Carbon
FIT
(To learn how a shoe should fit, check out our full podcast on fit by Matt Klein.)
Matt: The Altra Vanish Carbon 2 fits me true to size in my normal men's US size 10. The fit is classic to Altra with a wide toe box but is slightly more snug. There is still plenty of room and it feels wider than the original. The upper is see-through, incredibly light but still secure. The toe box has plenty of width and room for toe splay thanks to the anatomic shape. This transitions into a normal width midfoot with a thin but well-gusseted tongue. The gusset really helps secure the foot and the comfortable laces do not put excessive pressure on the top of the foot even when tightened. I did not have to tighten them that much to get a secure fit. This transitions into a normal-width heel with a small flexible heel counter and only strategic heel collar padding. The counter is only in the rear most portion of the heel and is fairly flexible. Those with heel sensitivities should be fine with this. There are two pads of heel collar cushioning on each side of the superior aspect of the heel. The heel tab comes up really high for some reason. I wear larger socks, so have not had any issue with rubbing but those with shorter socks may want to approach this cautiously or even consider cutting a slit to allow it to flex around the Achilles tendon. For this reason, I would not suggest sockless running although the inner aspect of the upper is quite comfortable against bare skin.
Typical Size: Men's US Size 10
Shoes that have fit Matt well: Saucony Guide 17, ASICS Kayano 30, Hoka Gaviota 5, Saucony Endorphin Elite, Nike Ultrafly
Shoes that have fit snug: Hoka Arahi 7, Saucony Kinvara 14
Shoes that have fit large: Salomon S/Lab Phantasm 2, Altra Timp 5
Andrea: The Altra Vanish Carbon 2 fits true to size in my usual women's 9.5. This shoe has Altra's "Slim" FootShape fit, which made me concerned that it would be too tight in the toe box because I found the "Standard" fit of the FWD Experience too narrow. While the Slim fit does not allow for comfortable toe splay the way the Escalante 3 or Torin 7 do, I found the toe box to be comfortable and non-constricting. I had a thumb's width of space between my big toe and the end of the shoe and was able to achieve secure lockdown easily. The midfoot and heel are normal width and the thin, gusseted tongue stays securely in place. The laces are on the long side but not so long that I would replace them.
The only skin irritation I experienced in this shoe was due to the thin material on the extended heel tab. During one of my runs, the material folded inward on both shoes, and I ended up with blisters on both Achilles. This was not an issue on subsequent runs, but something to be aware of if buying the shoe. The heel is mostly flexible, with a small rigid piece located at the lower central portion of the heel. There are two small pads at the top of the heel which were unnoticeable while running and seem to do a good job of helping to secure the rearfoot. The upper material is thin and see through and I found it quite breathable.
Andrea's Typical Size: Women's US Size 9.5
Shoes that have fit Andrea well: New Balance Beacon v3, Brooks Hyperion Max, Topo Cyclone 2, Nike Vaporfly 3, Altra Via Olympus 2
Shoes that have fit snug: Saucony Kinvara 14 (length and toe box width), Altra FWD Experience (length and width), Hoka Cielo Road (toe box width), Saucony Endorphin Speed and Pro 1-3 (length)
Shoes that have fit large: Adidas Boston 12 (length), Adidas Adios 8 (length)
David: The Altra Vanish Carbon 2 fit true to size in my men's 9.5. The length was fine, though I had this sensation that it felt a little short due to the little toe guard reinforcement on the upper. The width is pretty consistent with most Altra models. The heel and midfoot are normal width, with the forefoot being of a wider width. The heel is relatively loose fitting, since there only a small counter on the midline of the lower heel. The upper material has a synthetic feel to it and does not have a bunch of stretch. The dimensions give a good lockdown throughout and a pretty secure feeling. I will say the heel did have a bit of a floating sensation and I did have small amounts of medial and lateral translation when running in that area. The material in the heel collar seemed to get warm and cause hot spots as well. Otherwise the upper was reliable and did its job. The toe guard could probably be modified a little to help with that "short" feeling in the shoe.
Doctors of Running Checklist
Is This a Good Shoe for Walking: No
Is This a Good Shoe for Standing: No
Is the Forefoot Flexible: Mildly
How Flexible is the Shoe: Stiff
Is This a Good Heel Bevel: Yes
Recommended for Haglunds: Yes
Recommended for Sockless: No (heel tab)
Durability Expectation: Below Average
PERFORMANCE
Matt: The Altra Vanish Carbon 2 is a high stack, zero drop super racing shoe. The new blend of EGO PRO combined with the new 36 mm stack height provides a soft, bouncy, and responsive ride underfoot. This actually feels like a super foam and it responds well, especially at faster speeds. The weight is listed at 8.1 oz, but my size 10 weighs 8.1 oz and is the exact same weight as the original. This is awesome as it means the stack height increased from the original but the weight has maintained at 7.6 oz for men's size 9. The weight feels lighter than that, providing a nimble and fast feel. The zero drop is noticeable, although not as aggressive feeling as others thanks to the well beveled and rounded heel and the mild forefoot flexibility.
Consistent with many Altra shoes that have a rounded heel, the heel transition is smooth. This transitions into a slightly stiff and snappy midfoot where the plate really becomes apparent. This then continues into a snappy forefoot, where the pronged plate actually provides a little flexibility. This mild flexibility is nice, particularly at higher speeds and longer efforts. I personally have found that plates that are too stiff can bother my feet during longer, but the mild flexibility makes the front incredibly smooth. The forefoot rocker starts slightly early, further making for a smooth toe-off.
Pace-wise the Vanish Carbon 2 excels as a faster racing shoe but can also handle long distances. I have done several fast fartleks, a tempo run and a longer run in this shoe and it has done well with all of those efforts. It felt best during the tempo run where a consistent effort is needed, making me think it will excel at 10k-half marathon efforts. However, as the shoe broke in, it has also felt comfortable during easy and longer efforts. I have pushed it down to 5k efforts and it was able to do them. It would not necessarily be my first choice for a 5k, but I may have to test it soon during a race to see how it responds.
Given the amount of exposed outsole and the gaps in the forefoot under the plate, I would keep this shoe to road and smooth surfaces. The biggest concern from the last version was the outsole durability. Everything was going great with this version until the end of my last run before this review. At 24 miles, I tore the anterior aspect of the posterior lateral outsole piece off and the whole thing began to peel off. I do have odd mechanics where I scuff either the heel or the midfoot on my left side. Most people should be fine if they don't land weird like me. However, I have already begun to notice some premature wear at the forefoot and the exposed EGO PRO in the lateral midfoot. I have shoe gooed the piece back on and have not had any further issues after 35 miles. However, those who scuff their feet may still want to be cautious with this shoe.
Andrea: The Altra Vanish Carbon 2 is a true zero drop super shoe that has the bounce and cushioning I would expect from a super foam. I did not get to test version 1, but I think version 2 is definitely the super shoe that zero drop fans have been waiting for. I tested the shoe at a variety of paces, from easy all the way to mile pace. The shoe felt better for me at faster paces (10k and below) and I found it somewhat uncomfortable to run my warmup and cooldown in due to the location of the flex grooves in the forefoot. The main reason for this is that the flex groove closest to the midfoot hits behind my 1st MTP, and I could feel this flex point in my medial longitudinal arch, which caused a fair amount of discomfort.
Picking up the pace to 10k pace or faster and subsequently landing further forward caused this discomfort to completely resolve. This issue would keep me from using the shoe for a half marathon or marathon, but for those whose 1st MTP lines up better with the flex grooves, I think this shoe could be a do it all racer. It has that familiar bounce and propulsive sensation of other super shoes thanks to the EGO PRO midsole and early forefoot rocker, and its sub-6oz weight for a women's size 8 makes it comparable to the the Vaporfly 3. I really enjoyed doing 5k and mile pace repeats in the shoe and was pleased to not have much calf soreness after these workouts. The stiff platform and high stack somewhat reduce the stress of the zero drop on my calves, ankles, and feet.
I have 25 miles on my pair and the outsole shows minimal wear. One of my workouts was on wet roads and I had no issues with traction thanks to the extensive rubber coverage of the outsole. I would expect good durability from the outsole (although I know Matt had a different experience with how he lands) and this is definitely a super shoe that should do well in wet conditions. While I did not test the shoe in the rain, I would expect the mesh upper to drain easily and to not hold water.
David: The Altra Vanish Carbon 2 performed pretty well across the board. The shoe is a zero drop ratio as many other Altra models are. The heel has a decent sized bevel to it, with a more gradual forefoot rocker and toe spring up front. The carbon plate is a little more flexible at the toes than some other super shoes. This is definitely noticeable when loaded or bent, so for those wanting a little more give in their plates, this could be worth looking into. The midsole is Peba based and feels like it. The foam is soft without being overly compliant. The shoe has a very balanced feel to it underneath. It does not feel like it pushes you forward a bunch or is overly rounded. For the most part, the shoe lets you use the geometry to your liking, as it is not aggressive in either direction. This does feel pretty good when using it on the track or faster situations. The Vanish Carbon 2 still feels good at rhythmic paces as well. In some ways the shoe feels like a faster daily trainer. It does not come off ultra responsive, aggressive, or "racey" on step in, but it can do a little bit of everything with decent comfort. The outsole traction does its job pretty well and I did not have any limitations in that department. There is a decent amount of rubber, but it does seem to abrase on the easier end of things. I am not sure I would pick this shoe over other super shoes for any specific distance, but it does a pretty good job at being able to perform 5k to marathon. It has become a nice training companion shoe for me. Though I'd probably race in another shoe, this is something you could get the job done in. Because it is so "middle of the road" I almost want it to have more pop through the forefoot or a more aggressive geometry. This is a jack of all trades, though perhaps a master of none type racing shoe.
STABILITY
Matt: The Altra Vanish Carbon 2 is a neutral shoe but has several stable elements. Classic to Altra, the sole is on the wider side. The midfoot does not narrow and is a similar width to the rest of the shoe. The has moderate sidewalls that taper off in the midfoot. These create a centered ride at the rearfoot. In addition to the sidewalls, the rounded heel is beveled more at the posterior lateral side. Combined with the mild split heel, this creates some mild lateral guidance at heel strike. In the forefoot, while the plate creates a high level of torsional rigidity, there is some flexibility in the sagittal plane. This creates a solid forward facilitation of motion at the front. The combination of these elements make for inherently stable elements along the length of the shoe, without being a stability or intrusive shoe.
Andrea: The Altra Vanish Carbon 2 is a neutral zero drop super shoe that requires sufficient calf strength and ankle mobility, but may be less stressful than other zero drop shoes that have a more flexible platform. The shoe has some centering elements that are well done, including medial and lateral rearfoot sidewalls that do feel like they help center the heel. The forefoot rocker and overall stiff platform provide some reduction in the demands that the zero drop places on the ankles and calves. The forefoot flex grooves provide some balance to the stiff platform, but the location of the flex grooves may pose issues for runners with shorter toes relative to their foot length, like I experienced. I used the Minimalist Index calculator for the shoe, and it received a score of 48%, whereas the Escalante Racer has a score of 76%. The difference is in the longitudinal and torsional stiffness of the platform as well as the higher stack of the Vanish Carbon 2 as compared to the Escalante Racer, both of which potentially reduces stressed on the feet and ankles.
David: The Altra Vanish Carbon 2 is decently stable for a super shoe. The upper lockdown is good throughout and keeps you on a trusty platform. The base platform underfoot is decently wide and also has pretty good traction. There is also some gentle sole flaring from the heel through the forefoot. This is one of the few super shoes that I feel comfortable getting on some dirt if I needed to. Its still a very neutral design, but does give some elements of stability throughout.
Thoughts as a DPT: Plantar Pressures and Midsole Compression Over Time
By Matthew Klein
We had an excellent podcast/interview with Altra where we got to dive into all things zero-drop. One of the questions I asked originated from a concern about midsole compression with zero-drop platforms. While shoes often have a listed heel-toe drop (difference in height between the front and back of the shoe), that is a static number. That number actually changes depending on your footstrike and the point of the gait cycle you are loading the shoe. For heel strikers, at initial contact (landing), the heel drop will be lower than listed as the heel foam is compressed more relative to the forefoot. This will change as they progress into the later stages of stance phase (foot on the ground) and compress the forefoot, making the drop higher than the listed drop as the forefoot is compressed relative to the heel. Forefoot strikers will always create a mild heel drop as they compress the forefoot primarily during landing and toe-off. Continued use of any shoe and eventual degradation of the midsoles will cause certain parts to compress more than others, continuing to change the drop with age/wear.
What this means is that rearfoot strikers must spend extra time working on calf strength and ankle and calf mobility if they want to try a minimalist or zero-drop shoe. Even if the front of the shoe compresses more, the shift in plantar pressures is a result of greater work by the calf muscles, which means more strength and power are needed from the muscle group for normal propulsion. So even as the shoe "breaks in", you will still be using more plantarflexor force, which means you need to have adequately prepared calf muscles to handle what you will be asking of them. DOR emphasizing working on calf strength and ankle mobility transitioning to a lower or zero drop shoe is not new, but hopefully, some of the science and reasoning behind this makes more sense as to why we suggest this.
RECOMMENDATIONS
Matt: The Altra Vanish Carbon 2 is what the original should have been. The foam upgrade, increased stack height, geometry (both external and internal from the plate) and ride are all excellent. This is now a true super shoe and I look forward to Altra continuing to progress this model. My only recommendation is the outsole. Although this is from my unique midfoot scuffing, I have already torn off the anterior aspect of the posterior-lateral outsole piece after 24 miles. This was absolutely crushing as I have enjoyed this shoe so much during my short time with it. Like the original, I am sure if I clip it off or shoe-goo it (which I am actually doing now), I will still be able to get more miles out of this shoe. However, for $260 this is still disappointing. The performance is there, but the durability just needs to keep up. I would honestly suggest extending the outsole coverage on the medial and lateral sides of the sole just to maintain continuity and prevent people like me from clipping them and pulling them off. Outside of that, this is an excellent, unique super shoe that I just wish lasted longer for me.
Andrea: I have mostly enjoyed testing the Altra Vanish Carbon 2, but the placement of the forefoot flex grooves has limited the use of the shoe to faster paces. This may not be an issue for everyone, but it would certainly have made the shoe more enjoyable for me at slower paces (including marathon pace) if the flex grooves were placed a little further forward. Besides this, the only recommendations I would make are small ones: fix the extra material at the top of the heel tab and shorten the laces a touch.
David: I enjoyed my time in the Altra Vanish Carbon 2, but would like to see some updates. I did get a floating sensation in the heel coupled with some medial and lateral translation. If they could fortify the fit to help with the frontal plane forces I would appreciate that. The toe guard in the front of the shoe also feels unnecessary. It gives a sensation of the shoe being short and a subjective place of pressure. The other would be to make the platform itself have some faster transitions. The shoe doesn't feel like a crazy responsive racing shoe. It feels like a softer and lighter training shoe at the moment. That isn't a bad thing per se, but I struggle to pick this over some of the other racing shoes out right now.
WHO IS THIS SHOE FOR?
Matt: The Altra Vanish Carbon 2 is for those who want a super shoe with an anatomic, zero drop design. The fit is comfortable, has some extra volume and secure for those with normal width feet. The midsole is bouncy and responsive, finally feeling like a true super shoe design. The unique 3 pronged plate provides some mild flexibility that still feels snappy. The only issue is that it will work best for those who are light on their feet and not hard on outsoles like me. The overall design is a massive improvement from the prior version and provides something unique that exists nowhere else on the market. To finally have a super shoe for those who want a more natural foot position is awesome. However, that outsole needs to be a bit more durable to justify that price tag.
Andrea: The Altra Vanish Carbon 2 is a zero drop super shoe whose low weight and responsive midsole make it a potential do it all racer. It is what I would imagine a super shoe from Altra should be - zero drop, comfortable fit, and the performance of a super foam. While Matt had durability issues with the rearfoot outsole, I am actually impressed by the extensive rubber coverage and durability of the outsole in such a lightweight shoe. For runners who prefer a zero drop shoe and have been looking for a true super shoe to race in, this may be the shoe for you.
David: The Altra Vanish Carbon 2 is a super shoe for someone looking to have a balanced and not very aggressive platform underfoot. The shoe has good cushioning and decent responsiveness. The carbon plate in this model is a little more flexible through the forefoot than other super shoes that are out. The Vanish Carbon 2 feels like a soft and really light training shoe in some regards, and will work well for someone that wants a more easy going racing platform.
GRADES
Matt
Fit: A- (Secure, anatomic fit. Heel tab a little high but no issues so far)
Performance: A (Fun bouncy ride that excels at 10k to half marathon paces with the versatility to go up, down and even a little easy)
Stability: B+/A- [Neutral] (Heel sidewalls, wider midfoot, good forefoot transition)
Value: C+/B- (Incredibly unique shoe but having to shoe goo outsole back on at 24 miles is disappointing)
Personal: B+ (I absolutely love the fit and ride of this shoe. This would be one of my top shoes of the year if not for the outsole durability being emotionally crushing)
Overall Design: B+/A-
Andrea
Fit: A- (comfortable fit with just enough room in the toe box, secure lockdown, but high heel tab has potential to cause blisters)
Performance: A- (Flex groove placement limited this shoe to faster paces where I land further forward, but at faster paces this shoe feels like a super shoe should - bouncy, propulsive, and light.)
Stability: B+/A- [Neutral] (Sidewalls, stiff platform, and forefoot rocker help center the foot and provide guidance to forward motion)
Value: A- (A unique super shoe option for zero drop runners.)
Personal: B+/A- (Misaligned flex groove caused arch pain at slower paces, but the shoe felt amazing at 10k pace or faster)
Overall Design: B+/A-
David
Fit: B (The dimensions themselves are good. The toe guard up front gave some rubbing and a sensation of the shoe being "short" when it wasn't, and the heel material created some hot spots. I did have some translation in the heel as well.)
Performance: B+ (Good cushioning with decent responsiveness, though the platform is very modest for a racing shoe. The shoe feels a little flat and a more like a training shoe. This makes for a really nice training companion, though difficult to choose for a race over other super shoes.)
Stability: A- [Neutral] (Definitely a neutral shoe, but decent sole flaring, platform width, upper lockdown, traction)
Value: B+/A- (Those wanting either zero drop or a friendlier platform in a racing shoe have that here, durability might need some more testing)
Personal: B+/A- (I actually really like using this shoe for workouts, but don't find I quite get enough out of it to call on it on race day over other shoes)
Overall Design: B+/A-
SHOP | SUPPORT DORAltra Vanish Carbon 2Price: $259.95 at Running Warehouse
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